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df



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PostSubject: Angus longevity   Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:30 pm

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Grassfarmer



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Location : Belmont, Manitoba, Canada

PostSubject: Re: Angus longevity   Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:24 pm

I would question the assertion that the research herd's management and nutrition status are higher than commercial producers if they had a third fail after one calf. Commercial operations would be going out of business with more regularity if they were achieving results worse than (or as bad as) this.
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PatB



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Location : Turner, Maine

PostSubject: Re: Angus longevity   Wed Nov 14, 2012 7:32 am

The herd management and sire selection for the herd needs to be seriously looked at. The drop out rate is far too high in the first calvers.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Angus longevity   Wed Nov 14, 2012 8:23 am

PatB wrote:
The herd management and sire selection for the herd needs to be seriously looked at. The drop out rate is far too high in the first calvers.
welcome to the Southeast Pat...and in regard to sire selection, go read Pratt again...
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jhudson



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PostSubject: Longevity   Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:06 am

Thank you Mike. Most do not appreciate unique issues presented in our part of country. Also this shows the hype of " we sell them by the pound" . There is so much more to profit than pounds. Also recall those breeders that promote rolling generations and flushing heifers. Pat, does black angus have epd for longevity or is trait heritable? Jim
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df



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PostSubject: Re: Angus longevity   Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:35 am

jhudson wrote:
Thank you Mike. Most do not appreciate unique issues presented in our part of country. Also this shows the hype of " we sell them by the pound" . There is so much more to profit than pounds. Also recall those breeders that promote rolling generations and flushing heifers. Pat, does black angus have epd for longevity or is trait heritable? Jim

AAA has an EPD for Heifer Pregnancy but not Stayability. It is low in heritability. If I remember correctly, various estimates are 0.05 to 0.25 depending on the population that has been studied. I think 0.15-0.20 is the most often quoted range.
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PatB



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PostSubject: Re: Angus longevity   Wed Nov 14, 2012 12:26 pm

MKeeney wrote:
PatB wrote:
The herd management and sire selection for the herd needs to be seriously looked at. The drop out rate is far too high in the first calvers.
welcome to the Southeast Pat...and in regard to sire selection, go read Pratt again...

Wouldn't sires raised from fescue and heat tolerant older cows increase your odds of having heifers rebreed after first calves? I think I would be selecting for sires whose daughters rebreed on time and continue to produce under the management conditions. The last thought is pasture management must play a roll in this also.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Angus longevity   Wed Nov 14, 2012 12:54 pm

[quote="PatB"]
MKeeney wrote:
PatB wrote:
The herd management and sire selection for the herd needs to be seriously looked at. The drop out rate is far too high in the first calvers.
welcome to the Southeast Pat...and in regard to sire selection, go read Pratt again...

Wouldn't sires raised from fescue and heat tolerant older cows increase your odds of having heifers rebreed after first calves?

why certainly, about 5-10% worth...

I think I would be selecting for sires whose daughters rebreed on time and continue to produce under the management conditions.

that would make me a customer of MR. Pharo; instead, I am a student of Paine...."The character which Mr. Washington has attempted to act in the world is a sort of nondescribable, chameleon-colored thing called prudence. It is, in many cases, a substitute for principle, and is so nearly allied to hypocrisy that it easily slides into it....Mr. Washington may now, perhaps, learn, when it is too late to be of any use to him, that a man will pass better through the world with a thousand open errors upon his back than in being detected in one sly falsehood. When one is detected, a thousand are suspected".[/b][/i]--


The last thought is pasture management must play a roll in this also.

try herd management...change to fall calving; problem solved...
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MVCatt



Posts : 114
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Age : 43
Location : SW Penn

PostSubject: Re: Angus longevity   Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:38 pm

[quote="MKeeney"]
PatB wrote:
MKeeney wrote:
PatB wrote:
The herd management and sire selection for the herd needs to be seriously looked at. The drop out rate is far too high in the first calvers.
welcome to the Southeast Pat...and in regard to sire selection, go read Pratt again...

Wouldn't sires raised from fescue and heat tolerant older cows increase your odds of having heifers rebreed after first calves?

why certainly, about 5-10% worth...

I think I would be selecting for sires whose daughters rebreed on time and continue to produce under the management conditions.

that would make me a customer of MR. Pharo; instead, I am a student of Paine...."The character which Mr. Washington has attempted to act in the world is a sort of nondescribable, chameleon-colored thing called prudence. It is, in many cases, a substitute for principle, and is so nearly allied to hypocrisy that it easily slides into it....Mr. Washington may now, perhaps, learn, when it is too late to be of any use to him, that a man will pass better through the world with a thousand open errors upon his back than in being detected in one sly falsehood. When one is detected, a thousand are suspected".[/b][/i]--


The last thought is pasture management must play a roll in this also.

try herd management...change to fall calving; problem solved...

Oh...you silly fescue guys do the craziest things.
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