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 Wye catalog

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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:56 pm

AWWW Yes...different strokes for different folks...

I know you were pleased to have Leroy visit you...will Kate be coming by as well ?  Smile 

http://www.eonline.com/news/530334/kate-middleton-and-prince-william-lay-wreath-at-war-memorial-in-latest-stop-on-whirlwind-new-zealand-tour
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pukerimu



Posts : 100
Join date : 2012-06-02
Location : Norsewood, New Zealand

PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Fri Apr 11, 2014 12:44 am

Sad Sadly Norsewood not on their itinerary - we wish - NZ being swept in a wave of Royalist fever - have to admit to being a fan  king 
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Bob H



Posts : 292
Join date : 2011-02-17
Location : SW Idaho

PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Fri Apr 11, 2014 7:24 am

I am not sure that you can just eye ball bulls and get what you want. If you do not research what the breeders goals and philosophies are and what the cow herd has produced in the past you are taking a big chance. One more thing that is apparent to me is if you want what the breeder has you need to change your eye to his when selecting bulls.. Bob H
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pukerimu



Posts : 100
Join date : 2012-06-02
Location : Norsewood, New Zealand

PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Fri Apr 11, 2014 4:30 pm

Could not agree more Bob H - you need to know as much as possible about other people's breeding programs before you would even consider introducing the results into yours. Not sure how reliable the US EPD system is but you might be as amused as us, that a recent change (1st April) to our EBVs (a 400kg carcase more desirable now than the previous 300kg - NZ and Australia wide), has seen our cattle become much more attractive, if judged by their figures, than they were on the 31st of March 2014, 2013, 2012 etc etc - same goes for many of the bulls that we have bought over the years that were eschewed by our erstwhile stud colleagues as just not having "good enough data". As far as we can see they are still the same cattle as they were on the 1st of March when they were dog tucker according to Breedplan.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Sun Jan 24, 2016 11:18 am

out in the marketing world ran across another good looking linebred Fabron...a little search shows 2.09% inbreeding; I guess the shot of Emblazon didn`t help; probably helped "the look"...unlikely to help the outcome of the progeny...
I won`t ever use the word "linebred" again ...it`s meaning has been destroyed by the con men...true homozygousity would be a dna/genomic crowd function I would find interesting at least; perhaps limited usefulness?
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Sun Jan 24, 2016 12:08 pm

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Mean Spirit



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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Mon Jan 25, 2016 6:17 pm

I get caught up in inbreeding coefficients a little bit, but only in general ranges. How can anybody be confidant enough in IBC calculation to know that 12.5% is optimum? Its like they actually don't know what an IBC calculation is-- its clearly not an exact number with a high degree of confidence. And the purported difference between inbreeding and linebreeding- the whole "no greater than 50% of the blood" thing-- sounds like so much bs. And I managed to finally look at the Lentz book. Clearly, the need for a correct useful book on linebreeding in cattle still exists.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:14 pm

Mean Spirit wrote:
I get caught up in inbreeding coefficients a little bit, but only in general ranges. How can anybody be confidant enough in IBC calculation to know that 12.5% is optimum?   Its like they actually don't know what an IBC calculation is-- its clearly not an exact number with a high degree of confidence.  And the purported difference between inbreeding and linebreeding- the whole "no greater than 50% of the blood" thing-- sounds like so much bs.  And I managed to finally look at the Lentz book.  Clearly, the need for a correct useful book on linebreeding in cattle still exists.

cheers


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Grassfarmer



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Location : Belmont, Manitoba, Canada

PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:52 pm

Mean Spirit wrote:
I get caught up in inbreeding coefficients a little bit, but only in general ranges. How can anybody be confidant enough in IBC calculation to know that 12.5% is optimum?   Its like they actually don't know what an IBC calculation is-- its clearly not an exact number with a high degree of confidence.  And the purported difference between inbreeding and linebreeding- the whole "no greater than 50% of the blood" thing-- sounds like so much bs.  And I managed to finally look at the Lentz book.  Clearly, the need for a correct useful book on linebreeding in cattle still exists.


I tallied our IBCs from the 2014 calf crop and the average came out to 18.8%. Range is from 9% to 28% with 17% of the animals being over 25% IBC which if I remember right is what Lents would consider "greater than 50% blood". Looking at the cattle I see no correlation between IBC score and physical appearance - ie the higher IBC scores do not look smaller or more "inbred".

On the road to being none the wiser...
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jonken



Posts : 115
Join date : 2011-12-17
Location : nemo

PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Tue Jan 26, 2016 1:45 am

Mean Spirit wrote:
I get caught up in inbreeding coefficients a little bit, but only in general ranges. How can anybody be confidant enough in IBC calculation to know that 12.5% is optimum?   Its like they actually don't know what an IBC calculation is-- its clearly not an exact number with a high degree of confidence.  And the purported difference between inbreeding and linebreeding- the whole "no greater than 50% of the blood" thing-- sounds like so much bs.  And I managed to finally look at the Lentz book.  Clearly, the need for a correct useful book on linebreeding in cattle still exists.

John , My experience ,  it is just that, a percent ( number ) . However breeder confidence / and or use of these figures does NOT construct meaningful herds / superior individuals . Experience and Time can . As for your book ...You are the author .    Jon
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jonken



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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Tue Jan 26, 2016 1:55 am

Looking at the cattle I see no correlation between IBC score and physical appearance - ie the higher IBC scores do not look smaller or more "inbred".

On the road to being none the wiser...[/quote]


Now all you have to do is decide which chapter in your book this will be .   Jon
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:31 pm

Wye update today...remind me again of why in a low growth, closed population we are bragging about the top gaining bull?
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Mean Spirit



Posts : 303
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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:31 am

MKeeney wrote:
Wye update today...remind me again of why in a low growth, closed population we are bragging about the top gaining bull?

(1) Because they're selling bulls, and bull buyers gotta have some place to start when sorting bulls, and ADG and WDA are comfortable first steps?, or
(2) Because they're trying to find the best growing cattle in the population for some reason?, or
(3) Because they work for the government and need to be doing something "sciency" or "measury" in order to show their bosses? or
(4) Because it's confusing figuring out what they should be doing with them if they aren't gain testing the yearlings?

How close are the performances anyway? I may have to look that up.
And wouldn't you expect even the "best" ones to eventually fall back to the group in his progeny?
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EddieM



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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Wed Jan 11, 2017 8:42 am

What is "Average" in a herd with a dozen herd sires?
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Wye catalog   Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:07 am

Mean Spirit wrote:
MKeeney wrote:
Wye update today...remind me again of why in a low growth, closed population we are bragging about the top gaining bull?

(1) Because they're selling bulls, and bull buyers gotta have some place to start when sorting bulls, and ADG and WDA are comfortable first steps?, or
(2) Because they're trying to find the best growing cattle in the population for some reason?, or
(3) Because they work for the government and need to be doing something "sciency" or "measury" in order to show their bosses? or
(4) Because it's confusing figuring out what they should be doing with them if they aren't gain testing the yearlings?

How close are the performances anyway?  I may have to look that up.
And wouldn't you expect even the "best" ones to eventually fall back to the group in his progeny?      

{7} all of the above V
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