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jonken



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PostSubject: Thought provoking excerpts   Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:20 pm

Sharing some book excerpts that seem worthy of passing along.  - Kendra

“Part of our neurosis as humans is our continual quest to manipulate and control aspects of our lives.  No aspect of Nature, including weather, is excluded from this quest.  Often in pursuit of our own personal interests, we fail to comprehend the repercussions of our attempts to “manhandle” the grandiose structure of Nature. “ – “Surviving Ourselves” by Eric Herm
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jonken



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:21 pm

Every farmer who sells hogs is required to pay a “checkoff” of 40 cents for every $100 in sales, which goes to the National Pork Board.  This quasi-governmental organization was established in 1985 to conduct advertising, research and organization on behalf of the pork industry, but it is prohibited from lobbying; similar programs fund campaigns for other commodities, including “Got Milk?” and “Beef.  It’s What’s for Dinner.”  Smaller-scale hog producers have criticized the Pork Board for handing over much of the approximately $50 million collected per year in the form of contracts with the National Pork Producers Council (NPPC), which typically promotes the interests of larger-scale producers and processors.  The NPPC, for example, used more than $50,000 of checkoff funds to hire a consulting firm to spy on family farm organizations in 1996.  The targeted groups Iowa Citizens for Community Improvement, Missouri Rural Crisis Center and the Land Stewardship Project forced the NPPC to pay back the funds and triggered an investigation that led the USDA to require greater separation between the two organizations (Oates 2000).

In 2006, however, the National Pork Board agreed to pay the NPPC $60 million over twenty years for the intellectual property rights to the marketing slogan, “Pork:  the Other White Meat.”  This slogan was mostly retired just four years later and replaced with “Be Inspired.”  The Humane Society of the United States filed a lawsuit, alleging that this was a thinly disguised payment for NPPCs lobbying efforts, but it was dismissed by a federal court in 2013.  Documents related to the sale suggest there was little justification for such a high price, as no other group would be likely to use the slogan (Wilde 2013b).
--- “Concentration and Power in the Food System by Philip H. Howard.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Fri Jan 20, 2017 8:45 am

it could be titled "the registered lies versus your brain"

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/01/donald-trump-lies-liar-effect-brain-214658

What happens when a lie hits your brain? The now-standard model was first proposed by Harvard University psychologist Daniel Gilbert more than 20 years ago. Gilbert argues that people see the world in two steps. First, even just briefly, we hold the lie as true: We must accept something in order to understand it. For instance, if someone were to tell us—hypothetically, of course—that there had been serious voter fraud in Virginia during the presidential election, we must for a fraction of a second accept that fraud did, in fact, take place. Only then do we take the second step, either completing the mental certification process (yes, fraud!) or rejecting it (what? no way). Unfortunately, while the first step is a natural part of thinking—it happens automatically and effortlessly—the second step can be easily disrupted. It takes work: We must actively choose to accept or reject each statement we hear. In certain circumstances, that verification simply fails to take place. As Gilbert writes, human minds, “when faced with shortages of time, energy, or conclusive evidence, may fail to unaccept the ideas that they involuntarily accept during comprehension.”

but after a steady stream of exaggerations, I react opposite...when faced with shortages of time, energy, or conclusive evidence, I tend to dis-believe all the great proclamations automatically...
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EddieM



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Fri Jan 20, 2017 10:19 am

MKeeney wrote:
it could be titled "the registered lies versus your brain"

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/01/donald-trump-lies-liar-effect-brain-214658

What happens when a lie hits your brain? The now-standard model was first proposed by Harvard University psychologist Daniel Gilbert more than 20 years ago. Gilbert argues that people see the world in two steps. First, even just briefly, we hold the lie as true: We must accept something in order to understand it. For instance, if someone were to tell us—hypothetically, of course—that there had been serious voter fraud in Virginia during the presidential election, we must for a fraction of a second accept that fraud did, in fact, take place. Only then do we take the second step, either completing the mental certification process (yes, fraud!) or rejecting it (what? no way). Unfortunately, while the first step is a natural part of thinking—it happens automatically and effortlessly—the second step can be easily disrupted. It takes work: We must actively choose to accept or reject each statement we hear. In certain circumstances, that verification simply fails to take place. As Gilbert writes, human minds, “when faced with shortages of time, energy, or conclusive evidence, may fail to unaccept the ideas that they involuntarily accept during comprehension.”

but after a steady stream of exaggerations, I react opposite...when faced with shortages of time, energy, or conclusive evidence, I tend to dis-believe all the great proclamations automatically...
Don't confuse anyone with the facts. It sells more news ... and livestock.
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jonken



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Sat Jan 21, 2017 12:52 pm

MKeeney wrote:
it could be titled "the registered lies versus your brain"

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/01/donald-trump-lies-liar-effect-brain-214658

What happens when a lie hits your brain? The now-standard model was first proposed by Harvard University psychologist Daniel Gilbert more than 20 years ago. Gilbert argues that people see the world in two steps. First, even just briefly, we hold the lie as true: We must accept something in order to understand it. For instance, if someone were to tell us—hypothetically, of course—that there had been serious voter fraud in Virginia during the presidential election, we must for a fraction of a second accept that fraud did, in fact, take place. Only then do we take the second step, either completing the mental certification process (yes, fraud!) or rejecting it (what? no way). Unfortunately, while the first step is a natural part of thinking—it happens automatically and effortlessly—the second step can be easily disrupted. It takes work: We must actively choose to accept or reject each statement we hear. In certain circumstances, that verification simply fails to take place. As Gilbert writes, human minds, “when faced with shortages of time, energy, or conclusive evidence, may fail to unaccept the ideas that they involuntarily accept during comprehension.”

but after a steady stream of exaggerations, I react opposite...when faced with shortages of time, energy, or conclusive evidence, I tend to dis-believe all the great proclamations automatically...

Gilbert argues that people see the world in two steps.  Before we can even get to the step of sorting out the lie, I question how stalled our brains become as we are short circuited with all of the distractions or bombardments, (or as we have been marketed into believing….. choices we have available for us to use when exercising our freedom to “be who we want to be, buy what we want to buy,  and thus convince ourselves that we are independent, non –controlled consumers exercising our  “freedom” of being/eating/wearing/ having the  “best  available.”   Relevancy and validity of the improvement seems to be what is  short circuited.  As stated in the referenced article “When we are overwhelmed with false, or potentially false, statements, our brains pretty quickly become so overworked that we stop trying to sift through everything. It’s called cognitive load—our limited cognitive resources are overburdened. It doesn’t matter how implausible the statements are; throw out enough of them, and people will inevitably absorb some. Eventually, without quite realizing it, our brains just give up trying to figure out what is true. “

A  favorite childhood recipe uses Italian  salad dressing, the simple, non-enhanced, non-diluted, non-flavor enriched Italian dressing.  Through modifications of the recipe, I have failed to create the desired quality product and taste that made it such a favorite in the first place.  However standing in the salad dressing aisle at the grocery store in search of the simple, most basic Italian dressing, I am bombarded with nearly 100 different salad dressing bottles to sort through.  Among them are at least 15 “Italian” dressings, and if none of them suit me, I can choose from 15 extra-virgin olive oils and 23 vinegars to make my own.  Regardless to the grocery store or chain, any request for help in locating the functional and desired, original, non-enhanced bottle of salad dressing results in additional bombardment of marketing which seems to be based on the assumption that I cognitively am not able to see the obvious benefits of the 15 improved and enhanced.   Attempts at polite explanations that if I were able to locate the non-enhanced bottle, I could apply my own creative measures to create my version of “enhanced” to suit my own likings is matched with further attempts that “I must not be aware of the current improvements and surely one of the other varieties would be a fair substitute as well as more convenient and time saving.”  It seems that my choice to my wants, has turned more into a test of self-determination than a freedom of mere choices.

At what point did my freedom to have the freedom to choose become a marketing platform?  As an American, with more choices and freedom than other countries, why does it seem that I (we) don’t seem to be benefiting from those freedoms psychologically?    It leads me to a few thoughts to ponder.

1.  Would we be better off if we embraced certain voluntary constraints on our freedom of choice, instead of rebelling against them?
2.  Would we be better off seeking what is “good enough” instead of seeking the best”?
3.  Would we be better off if we lowered our expectations about the results of our decisions?
-Kendra
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Bob H



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Thu Jan 26, 2017 8:02 am

I am not sure about any one else. But for Bob Howard this is what I believe that there is a God and Jesus died for my sins so I could be free. As we go thru life we have paradigms within our mind and we can choose to move forward with them or shift them to what we have learned if we continue to learn. About freedom what we write on this site is what the constitution is protecting and when we speak out of what we believe is freedom. About good enough that is fine for cattle but not for grandchildren, they should have the same rights that I have had in my life. When I look around the world it is apparent to me that we need to be thankful for what has been 240 years of success. It is not anywhere near perfect but to be able to have all of the people to have a voice if they desire and change if they can build enough momentum. Will it last I do not know if it is right yes if it is wrong no. But to do the same thing over and over and expect a different out come is insanity. I think that muddling our way thru this life is a good thing as we are only here for a short time.
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Bob H



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Thu Jan 26, 2017 10:52 am

Kendra,
This is Pam, Bob H wife. I sense an idea of "to settle" in your post! Which in life is to lower expectations. I believe that there is wisdom in finding balance. In creation and the long span of things, that is what will survive.
To have someone else limit choice is to make it a moving target At the mercy of those who would place the limits. The lowering of our expectations, values, and integrity.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:45 pm

just wanted to comment, I`m thinking ...and Bob, I do believe a bit of Isiah`s prophecy has been fulfilled...."and a little child shall lead them" ...Smile
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RobertMac



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Fri Jan 27, 2017 10:27 am

What is ironic is that Politico has an article about lies!
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Sat Jan 28, 2017 12:59 pm

RobertMac wrote:
What is ironic is that Politico has an article about lies!

I didn`t chop down George Washington`s cherry tree...it was a great tree ! Donald Trump...
I`ve never felt so superior in all my life, more common and human sense,  more character than the president of the usa... edit//I forgot more intelligent cheers cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Sun Jan 29, 2017 10:40 am

where will one apply for Christian verification papers for domestic flights to Idaho in July? What are the Christian residency requirements before applying? Will there be any fake ones floating around, or should one
be prepared to slip a little money under the table to a bureaucrat or in the offering plate to a preacher to clear the process as the holy wars continue ?
is HOLY WARS an oxymoron? Was Adam the first man to not "settle" for anything less than liberty?
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RobertMac



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:45 am

MKeeney wrote:
where will one apply for Christian verification papers for domestic flights to Idaho in July? What are the Christian residency requirements before applying? Will there be any fake ones floating around, or should one
be prepared to slip a little money under the table to a bureaucrat or in the offering plate to a preacher to clear the process as the holy wars continue ?
is HOLY WARS an oxymoron? Was Adam the first man to not "settle" for anything less than liberty?
Ridiculous
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:46 am

RobertMac wrote:
MKeeney wrote:
where will one apply for Christian verification papers for domestic flights to Idaho in July? What are the Christian residency requirements before applying? Will there be any fake ones floating around, or should one
be prepared to slip a little money under the table to a bureaucrat or in the offering plate to a preacher to clear the process as the holy wars continue ?
is HOLY WARS an oxymoron? Was Adam the first man to not "settle" for anything less than liberty?
Ridiculous
hardly...
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larkota



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:03 am

Keeney`s Corner
A reflective and futuristic view of cattle breeding from outside the registered mainstream
Rules
The only rule we will need here is the Golden Rule.


politics and religion has no place here, or so I thought.
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RobertMac



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:25 pm

larkota wrote:
Keeney`s Corner
A reflective and futuristic view of cattle breeding from outside the registered mainstream
Rules
The only rule we will need here is the Golden Rule.


politics and religion has no place here, or so I thought.  

If that's the case, fine with me...but I didn't put the Politico article here.
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Mon Jan 30, 2017 3:28 pm

Human nature determines cattle breeding directions..study it...
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EddieM



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Mon Jan 30, 2017 4:11 pm

facebook wrote:
I have attempted to form a judgment as to the conditions for evolution based on the statistical consequences of Mendelian heredity. The most general conclusion is that evolution depends on a certain balance among its factors. There must be a gene mutation, but an excessive rate gives an array of freaks, not evolution; there must be selection, but too severe a process destroys the field of variability, and thus the basis for further advance; prevalence of local inbreeding within a species has extremely important evolutionary consequences, but too close inbreeding leads merely to extinction. A certain amount of crossbreeding is favorable but not too much. In this dependence on balance the species is like a living organism. At all levels of organization life depends on the maintenance of a certain balance among its factors...Sewall Wright, Proceedings of the Sixth International Congress of Genetics: Ithaca, New York, 1932
Seems to be a dichotomy: Evolution is proven when the new species cannot replicate with the original species in crossbreeding. Seems that we do not want to seek out gene mutations to change a species. Oddly, we never see the progression of Darwin's evolution beyond what we had to start with. Maybe Lyell should have stayed a lawyer rather than take up amateur geology, guesser of the past and author of dataless theories. Seems to be oranges and bananas here in this comparative.
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Tue Jan 31, 2017 12:00 pm

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jonken



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:08 am

As an American, with more choices and freedom than other countries, why does it seem that I (we) don’t seem to be benefiting from those freedoms psychologically?
This was the heart of the initial post regarding freedoms and our difficulties in experiencing the possible liberation granted through those freedoms. I recently read a medical article quoting statistics from 2011 reporting 1 out of every 10 people in America, 10 years of age or older is taking anti-depressant medication.  Most intriguing though was the report that 80% of the world consumption of anti-depressants was from Americans.  It is baffling to understand how life in a country with freedom for religion, education, health care, employment,  sanitation, abundant food and water, unlimited choices for nearly everything imaginable can have less satisfied  people than those from areas with limited freedoms, poor or no sanitation, very little food, no health care and economic poverty.  It begs the question—Has our obsession with maximizing “better or best,” and overwhelming choices turned us into worshippers and evangelists of technology, wealth and power that surpasses the comprehension of most of us?  We would probably be deeply resentful if someone tried to take our freedom of choice away yet the burden of having every activity be a matter of deliberate analysis and conscious validation of relevant and irrelevant claims, has in most cases done exactly that.   Are we trapped in a tyranny of small decisions and voluntarily forfeited our ultimate freedom?

Would we be better off seeking what is “good enough” instead of seeking the best”?
Who determines best?  How similar is their position and experiences in life to our own?  How similar is their desired outcome to our own?  Is it possible that good enough implies contentment or happiness with one’s decision with no correlation to raising or lowering of expectations?    Is it possible that “good enough” (internally defined) and determined from conscious, informed and intentional decisions require more discipline/commitment and scrutiny of one’s situation than a (externally defined) system of comparisons to better or best? Unfortunately a less popular perspective, is that “good enough” does in fact satisfy the short term benefits of one’s needs while positively contributing to the long term benefits for our children and grandchildren.   In essence, shifting from a me-now focus to a 50 year plan.

Human’s inability to balance what is enough to make a living versus taking as much as possible has plagued our existence for centuries.  We’ve been convinced, or convinced ourselves that our identity and worth is defined by harvesting as much as humanely possible and most certainly before someone else gets it.  Much of our society seems to have bought into the false concept of perpetual or infinite growth being possible on a finite planet.  
Freedoms or not, tradeoffs do occur, and if we fail to balance our decisions, then limitations on our freedoms are inevitable.  The basic patterns of Yin-Yang relationships are inescapable.

Kendra
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outsidethebox



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Wed Feb 01, 2017 7:53 am

Thoughtful statement, Kendra. The human is a social being...and we need each other to meet our every need. But, despite our great intelligence, there remains a tendency for us to gravitate toward some very destructive behaviors. And curiously, the most ardent "followers" of Christianity fall flat on their individual and collective faces when it comes to living out the most basic tenet of said religion: "Love your neighbor as yourself". "We" have fallen victim to a warning from  "The Good Book"..."For what does it prophet a man if he gains the whole world but loses his own soul?" Collectively we have indeed lost our soul.

Disclaimer: Each of us has our own life story which makes us unique. I was raised as the son of a preacher man...in the Conservative Mennonite Conference no less...ordained by lot-which I remember...at the age of six. I am most grateful that my father was not your conventional lemming. I was a good boy...I was taught to think carefully for myself...while at the same time being most considerate of the needs of others. Today, in America, this makes me an outlier. I have now/finally arrived at the conclusion that religion, of any ilk, has no usefulness other than providing for social connections with our neighbors. I do not believe that Jesus intended to establish "Christianity"...we have made him God to meet our own delusional needs. Few claimants of being Christian come close to living as Jesus instructed...the world would actually be a better place if everyone did...let the excuses begin. Our creator, whatever, whomever that entity is, instilled a keen sense of right and wrong within us. Americans need to load up on antidepressants to cope with ourselves because we have collectively defied the sense of goodness that is already within each us. Pretty sad. And now there is Mr. Trump-exhibit A of what is wrong with us...I just have to chuckle at our stupidity...at both those celebrating and those weeping...this is who we are. Indeed, one of the human's greatest weaknesses is our inability to self-assess...right along with our ability to rationalize. "We" are quite the creation!
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Wed Feb 01, 2017 7:15 pm

John Boehner , former Republican speaker of the house , now a board member of JBS...A SUPPLY-DEMAND situation, there`s a large SUPPLY of congressmen who can be bought, and they DEMAND some money...the noose tightens...
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Wed Feb 01, 2017 7:44 pm

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jonken



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Sat Feb 04, 2017 10:57 pm

An Allegory and a True Story

The allegory:
Not long ago, a man named Jim was in business with his brother Bob. Jim was the hardworking, money-making side of the firm; Bob was the always smiling, money-spending side.  And, sure, Jim knew the arrangement was lopsided but he loved and trusted Bob and Bob was Jim’s greatest admirer and biggest promoter.  The business did well for years until one day, by pure chance, Jim discovered Bob had been stealing money from the company. It wasn’t much, about $21,500 out of the $21 million in revenue the company had earned over the past three years.
It was enough, however, to make Jim wonder how long Bob had been skimming company cream. Worse, the brothers had two out-of-state sisters as partners and Jim knew both would have to be told the truth about Bob.
So Jim confronted Bob and Bob made a tearful confession of his “mistake.” He repaid the $21,500 and the brothers moved on.  But the sisters didn’t. They asked Jim for a multi-year audit of the company’s books to ensure that Bob had not stolen more than $21,500 and to make certain other “mistakes” had not occurred under Jim’s aging eyes.  Both brothers balked. An audit would be expensive, disrupt business for months, and—who knew?—might turn up some expenses the sisters would object to. Reluctantly, however, Jim agreed to the audit.

A year went by and the sisters heard nothing from Jim other than his constant complaint that the audit “would kill the business.” The sisters hired an attorney who, in court, pressed for the audit’s results. It was, he argued, the sisters’ legal right to know how their money had been spent.  Moreover, the attorney added, not disclosing the results because it might “kill the business” was the very reason the results must be disclosed. “What were the brothers hiding?” he asked.  How did the fight end?
The way fights like this usually end. The brothers continued their stonewalling of the facts and the sisters continued their legal pursuit of those same facts until, indeed, both the business and the family imploded.

The true story:
By Feb. 17, the National Cattlemen’s Beef Association (NCBA) will file with the U.S. Department of Agriculture reasons it might have to keep private 9,300 or so pages of financial documents related to how it used public money, beef checkoff dollars.  The filing is the next step in the ongoing legal battle between the Organization for Competitive Markets and USDA’s Office of Inspector General (OIG) over documents surrounding OIG’s 2011 investigation into a government audit conducted by the Cattlemen’s Beef Board—known as the beef checkoff—and the Board’s principle contractor, NCBA.
NCBA has questioned public disclosure of the documents because, it claims, going public with how it spent millions in beef checkoff dollars will give away proprietary information and, worse, might threaten the very existence of the beef checkoff.
Yes, the money is public; the U.S. Supreme Court ruled long ago that federally-chartered, non-refundable commodity checkoffs are “government speech.” That should mean that “government” dollars collected and spent by federal checkoffs on public research, public promotion, public communications, and public market-building programs is, in fact, open to public oversight.  But, no, NCBA will likely argue, we can’t tell you, the public, how we spend your money as the checkoff’s decades-long, hired hand because telling you might hurt us, it, or both.  That, of course, is the best argument for full disclosure and the worst argument for a continued cover-up that anyone could make. What is so secret in NCBA’s dark checkoff closet that it can’t show you, the people who’ve bought and paid for that closet, because it will destroy the checkoff?

If it’s nothing, you should know. If it’s something, that’s an even greater reason for you to know. NCBA knows. You don’t.  Why?

Written by:  Alan Guebert,  published in The Farm & Food File and weekly newspapers throuhout US and Canada.

Kendra
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RobertMac



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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Sun Feb 05, 2017 8:03 pm

Four packers (Tyson, JBS, Cargill, and National Beef) control 80% of the beef market and are large in pork and poultry(except NB).

Who really believes ncba has ever made a difference in cattle prices?
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PostSubject: Re: Thought provoking excerpts   Mon Feb 06, 2017 6:22 am

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