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 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale

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pukerimu



Posts : 100
Join date : 2012-06-02
Location : Norsewood, New Zealand

PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sat May 06, 2017 5:38 pm

No we do not select for bigger cattle - early growth and maturity is much more important to us than ultimate size. Getting it all together in one animal is the real challenge and one which is rarely if ever accomplished. Made even more problematic when numbers are involved which in NZ at least often bear very little if any resemblance to what is standing in front of you now and in the generations following. I will grant you our birth, weaning, 400 and 600 day weights are fairly reliable estimates - they have much data behind them - it is the carcase numbers that seem to have no shame in their absurdity and as Breedplan is yet to make any use of our diligent body condition scoring when our cows are weighed every year then mature cow and any other maternal measurement has to be taken with a grain of salt.

Thank you for posting Caitlin - we are very proud of her!
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sat May 06, 2017 6:14 pm

I should have said heavier cattle earlier ...but selection for heavier cattle invarability makes bigger cattle mature...bend it a little but not much..
Trying go make one kind do all things well is such wasted
energy, but the waste fuels the registered game...
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pukerimu



Posts : 100
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Location : Norsewood, New Zealand

PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sat May 06, 2017 6:41 pm

I am fairly confident the only thing that is capable of bending a curve is a magic pencil ................
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sat May 06, 2017 6:51 pm

pukerimu wrote:
I am fairly confident the only thing that is capable of bending a curve is a magic pencil ................
The bw to yw ratio is quite an achievement ...if it isn't too pencil created Very Happy ..I obviously was quite impressed yesterday by the GAR bulls for terminal use...big bulls, and yes, well grain fed...
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sat May 06, 2017 8:28 pm

Because we have failed to create any public appreciation for our "brand" of female, a set of heifers sired by G A R bulls will bring more money than the females most of us here prefer...
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sat May 06, 2017 9:24 pm

MKeeney wrote:
Because we have failed to create any public appreciation for our "brand" of female, a set of heifers sired by G A R bulls will bring more money than the females most of us here prefer...


all has not been wasted; at least our exchange of experiences and ideas show how and why one should keep his own bulls to make his female replacements, saving money; rejuvenating the maternal genepool from elsewhere now and then ...and buy terminal bulls one step down from the famous at half the price to produce beef...pretty simple; simple saves, it doesn`t sell at premium...
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sun May 07, 2017 7:48 am

the teachings of Plato about how tyrants rise in “late-stage democracy”:

“He is usually of the elite but has a nature in tune with the time — given over to random pleasures and whims, feasting on
plenty of food and sex, and reveling in the nonjudgment that is democracy’s civil religion. He makes his move by ‘taking over
a particularly obedient mob’ and attacking his wealthy peers as corrupt. If not stopped quickly, his appetite for attacking the
rich on behalf of the people swells further. He is a traitor to his class — and soon, his elite enemies, shorn of popular legitimacy,
find a way to appease him or are forced to flee. Eventually, he stands alone, promising to cut through the paralysis of democratic
incoherence. It’s as if he were offering the addled, distracted, and self-indulgent citizens a kind of relief from democracy’s endless
choices and insecurities. He rides a backlash to excess — ‘too much freedom seems to change into nothing but too much slavery’ —
and offers himself as the personified answer to the internal conflicts of the democratic mess. He pledges, above all, to take on the
increasingly despised elites. And as the people thrill to him as a kind of solution, a democracy willingly, even impetuously, repeals itself

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EddieM



Posts : 648
Join date : 2010-09-24
Location : South Carolina

PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sun May 07, 2017 8:16 am

MKeeney wrote:
Because we have failed to create any public appreciation for our "brand" of female, a set of heifers sired by G A R bulls will bring more money than the females most of us here prefer...

Environmental fit? Cost of production? Net profit? Ability to sell useful livestock to neighbors and customers?

Bah Humbug.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sun May 07, 2017 9:51 am

EddieM wrote:
MKeeney wrote:
Because we have failed to create any public appreciation for our "brand" of female, a set of heifers sired by G A R bulls will bring more money than the females most of us here prefer...

Environmental fit?  Cost of production?  Net profit?  Ability to sell useful livestock to neighbors and customers?

Bah Humbug.

motion, commotion, and PROMOTION
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sun May 07, 2017 8:11 pm

MKeeney wrote:
MKeeney wrote:
Because we have failed to create any public appreciation for our "brand" of female, a set of heifers sired by G A R bulls will bring more money than the females most of us here prefer...


all has not been wasted; at least our exchange of experiences and ideas show how and why one should keep his own bulls to make his female replacements,  saving money; rejuvenating the maternal genepool from elsewhere now and then ...and buy terminal bulls one step down from the famous at half the price to produce beef...pretty simple; simple saves, it doesn`t sell at premium...

whoops...applies only if you are maintaining a purebred cowherd or have visions of becoming a Lasater...

good compliment today, wanting a bull from me WITH PAPERS...I have said before the ultimate success would be to have a maternal bull so
"good" that that same buyer would buy him anyway...now, I don`t believe that likely or even possible to create; compared to what some other maternal registered breeders are creating...so the only satisfaction is the confidence I`m doing just as good genetically as those with their papers... they just remain eligible for the games; I`d rather see the games end...won`t happen, too much money to be made in big time sports Smile
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Mon May 08, 2017 12:59 pm

some outcross blood for Megan`s consideration...and our confirmation of how successful selection for traits turns breed type into breeds that already exist "Wagyu in this instance"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viSdvL9Jg0Y
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Mon May 08, 2017 1:49 pm

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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Mon May 08, 2017 8:35 pm

the ad said "linebred to Luria of Wye 1022 who weaned 5 tons of calf in her lifetime... 28 times"

ibc 1.75%... meaning 98.25% of her genetic makeup consists of something besides Luria of Wye...

aaa 17751513    900 @9 months 1300 @1200 mo...

ce +13 .43 10% 1
bw-3.2 .67 2% 51
ww +51 .54 40% 51
yw +92 .53 35% 47

always interested in how bulls performance escape their ancestry...how does that pencil thing work Megan? Smile
interesting enough I ordered a performance pedigree Smile
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Mon May 08, 2017 9:06 pm

SHAQ wants to be a sheriff, 8 coal counties in Ky were the ones life expectancy decreased the most{war on coal the cause or cure?}
bill Clinton trying to write fiction stranger than his bio, and first attempt at golf in weeks created new aches and pains before the old ones healed...

cattle breeding is a relatively simple endeavor when you are young; the difficulty lies in staying young...
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EddieM



Posts : 648
Join date : 2010-09-24
Location : South Carolina

PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Mon May 08, 2017 9:11 pm

MKeeney wrote:
SHAQ wants to be a sheriff, 8 coal counties in Ky were the ones life expectancy decreased the most{war on coal the cause or cure?}
bill Clinton trying to write fiction stranger than his bio, and first attempt at golf in weeks created new aches and pains before the old ones healed...

cattle breeding is a relatively simple endeavor when you are young; the difficulty lies in staying young...
Maybe we need an EPD for Owner's Age.
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pukerimu



Posts : 100
Join date : 2012-06-02
Location : Norsewood, New Zealand

PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Mon May 08, 2017 9:20 pm

MKeeney wrote:
some outcross blood for Megan`s consideration...and our confirmation of how successful selection for traits turns breed type into breeds that already exist "Wagyu in this instance"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viSdvL9Jg0Y

Errrr um no thanks ............... all the same - we could buy one like that if we wanted - HPCA Intensity has been used in NZ (pure GAR on every line - from memory!) - the bulls at the bull evaluation unit show the extremities of GAR breeding - one of them looked not to bad at the open day but judging from most recent pic the extreme angularism seemingly a trait that GAR have been selecting on is becoming more and more apparent. Of course the data is to die for - as you would expect from generational pencil sharpening ............ magic pencil sharpening that is Smile

You know the kind of magic pencils that can magic up animals and associated performance milestones where none previously existed ............
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Mon May 08, 2017 9:46 pm

the selection is for marbling, and the type sharpens as marbling increases...basic genetics, and the JAD axiom...you can`t change them without changing them...basic genetics, no pencil involved except to write out the excuses for the daughters that result from marbling selection...same with the Brits and their selection for rea and leanness; epds work...

Eddie, record the days without Aleve... Sad
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue May 09, 2017 8:33 am

REPORTING CASH PRICES WITH A BLOCKCHAIN



The solution to the reporting problem exists and can be quickly implemented. It is called a block chain and takes each transaction for cattle either fed, feeder or stocker and creates a block transaction, confirmed by buyer and seller, then linked to a chain in time order. Transactions would be posted in a linear time line and would include the delivery period, by week for the first 30 days then by two weeks, up to 60 days then by month. Industry participants could view the blockchain but not individual transactions or names. They could review transactions by region, by delivery period, or nationally. The block chain would serve as a cash settlement tool for the CME live cattle contract that is struggling. Industry leaders say it is a good idea but needs to be studied and will take years to implement.



A group of Aussie wheat farmers didn't agree. They were unable to find prices offered by grain terminals in different geographic locations. They were forced to simple accept the local bid. Furthermore, once they accepted bids for their wheat, the settlement and clearing of the transaction took 45 days. In six months they put in place a blockchain that now allows them to view bids from locations all over their area and has decreased the settlement and payment to two business days.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue May 09, 2017 9:15 pm

MKeeney wrote:
the ad said "linebred to Luria of Wye 1022 who weaned 5 tons of calf in her lifetime... 28 times"

ibc 1.75%... meaning 98.25% of her genetic makeup consists of something besides Luria of Wye...

    900 @9 months 1300 @1200 mo...

ce +13 .43 10% 1
bw-3.2 .67 2% 51
ww +51 .54 40% 51
yw +92 .53 35% 47

always interested in how bulls performance escape their ancestry...how does that pencil thing work Megan? Smile
interesting enough I ordered a performance pedigree Smile

93 ratio bw, 118 weaning, 123 yw ration meaning 10 contemporaries weighed 1000
16inch rea...1 hd in group.. and other things lead one to say

if not a fraud, a freak...I`ll use neither...
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EddieM



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Location : South Carolina

PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed May 10, 2017 6:13 am

MKeeney wrote:
MKeeney wrote:
the ad said "linebred to Luria of Wye 1022 who weaned 5 tons of calf in her lifetime... 28 times"

ibc 1.75%... meaning 98.25% of her genetic makeup consists of something besides Luria of Wye...

    900 @9 months 1300 @1200 mo...

ce +13 .43 10% 1
bw-3.2 .67 2% 51
ww +51 .54 40% 51
yw +92 .53 35% 47

always interested in how bulls performance escape their ancestry...how does that pencil thing work Megan? Smile
interesting enough I ordered a performance pedigree Smile

93 ratio bw, 118 weaning, 123 yw ration meaning 10 contemporaries weighed 1000
16inch rea...1 hd in group.. and other things lead one to say

if not a fraud, a freak...I`ll use neither...
I hear the feed truck coming. Or with ibc 1.75% just a good example of hybrid vigor with line crosses? One more personal effort to "Let's make Angus great again". And for one generation: success.
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed May 10, 2017 6:49 am

I don`t know, an epd with accuracy is a better guess than an epd with no accuracy is all I know...I can`t disprove everything, it would take 100,000 cows Smile

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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed May 10, 2017 8:22 am

Claire Danes is assured of 5 more seasons if the writers can make the fiction stranger than...well, hell, there is no truth; it`s all fiction Smile

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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sat May 13, 2017 8:42 am

Pippa Passes
When Alice Lloyd made her way by horse and buggy to the mountains of Eastern Kentucky a century ago, doctors had said the sickly New Englander had little time to live. She was looking for a place with a warmer climate that might ease her health problems.
Instead, she found her life’s purpose.

Read more here: http://www.kentucky.com/news/state/article150215277.html#storylink=cpy
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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sat May 13, 2017 9:38 pm

the nice thing about terminal cattle is you can sell them sight unseen by their numbers/indexes etc; as I did today...Larry and I sparred about a maternal "index" here some ago...I still think you need a better numerical accounting of maternal value than currently exists...well, it wouldn`t take much to be more...yeah, it would likely be used more for marketing than breeding...yes, I don`t think the tru type maternal breeders are being paid equivalent value in comparison to terminal...
in fact, does the marketplace actually recognize a separation of selection let alone the practice thereof ?
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EddieM



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PostSubject: Re: 2017 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sun May 14, 2017 9:24 am

Would EPD and current bovine genetic testing data be permissible as undeniable evidence in a court of law?

Of all the sparring that you and Larry did, what were the major topics and who won?
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