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 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale

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MKeeney
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PostSubject: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Mon Jan 25, 2016 9:48 pm

Since we don`t follow the mainstream plan pictured, neither our bulls or our adaptive forages become obsolete...some bulls wear out,
but our maternal program of consistent renewal creates a ready supply, and alas, a cheaper price...is that a bad thing for a commercial
breeder producing his own replacement females?

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jonken



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue Jan 26, 2016 2:44 am

MKeeney wrote:
Since we don`t follow the mainstream plan pictured, neither our bulls or our adaptive forages become obsolete...some bulls wear out,
but our maternal program of consistent renewal creates a ready supply, and alas, a cheaper price...is that a bad thing for a commercial
breeder producing his own replacement females?



 Not sure Mike . Don't forget bred heifers . Maybe this quote from the SHOW ME SELECT HEIFER PROGRAM can explain their agenda . " At the end of the day , most participants measure their improvement by the MONEY AFTER the sale .  ...............                                     Jon
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:33 am

I`m not finding as many things to like out on facebook as most do...for example, this concept of "phenotypically flawless"...
says who, when? what`s a shave and a haircut cost these days? I thought we were living in the computer data age

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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue Jan 26, 2016 9:07 am

MKeeney wrote:
I`m not finding as many things to like out on facebook as most do...for example, this concept of "phenotypically flawless"...
says who, when? what`s a shave and a haircut cost these days? I thought we were living in the computer data age


a 100 years of improvement over this ?

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Bob H



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue Jan 26, 2016 10:10 am

The second picture is it from 100 years ago and why would you want to improve that.
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larkota



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue Jan 26, 2016 12:08 pm

neither my cows or heifers carry that much condition. would like to see what they would like in work clothes in stead of prom nite.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue Jan 26, 2016 12:43 pm

larkota wrote:
neither my cows or heifers carry that much condition.  would like to see what they would like in work clothes in stead of prom nite.
The cow or the club calf? Rolling Eyes
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue Jan 26, 2016 9:45 pm

MKeeney wrote:
Since we don`t follow the mainstream plan pictured, neither our bulls or our adaptive forages become obsolete...some bulls wear out,
but our maternal program of consistent renewal creates a ready supply, and alas, a cheaper price...is that a bad thing for a commercial
breeder producing his own replacement females?


What a club out there on Face Book ...all "like" each others BS, they have too, it`s a constant program among them; all after a pretty bull
with a bigger number...the other constants are


Never have so many, done so little, with so much, to change the
efficiency of beef production from conception to the consumer..
.



one more

When I was younger, I didn`t have enough money to travel first class in the cattle business, and now that I`m old, I`m too dang smart  Smile  Smile

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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed Jan 27, 2016 8:37 am

MKeeney wrote:
I`m not finding as many things to like out on facebook as most do...for example, this concept of "phenotypically flawless"...
says who, when? what`s a shave and a haircut cost these days? I thought we were living in the computer data age


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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Thu Jan 28, 2016 10:42 pm

near 3 weeks on facebook now and I`m just in awe...every breeder is making great cows; and the best we can do is just make ordinary cows like below, more often...the other breeders don`t even select for their great cows; they are just the by-product of breeding for greater growth numbers; I readily admit that I have to make breeding for this kind my priority to get them as often as we do...we even have to use our own bulls produced in our environment; while these magic breeders in Iowa can AI to everyone else`s bull;feed the male progeny corn in the feedlot to find the biggest yearlings, and that results in sisters that are great on fescue pasture...another breeder can graze irrigated Alfalfa in Montana and use a DNA test to find fescue adapted cattle...isn`t science wonderful??...for promotional sake if nothing else !
One positive in our favor; you can probably run close to three of our cows on the feed that they run two...and if you want more calf, just breed them to Charolais bulls, repeat our profile picture, and sell 30% more calf than the elites for more per pound...
Of course, that`s commercial dollars, and no respected registered breeder can live on that...we always have, always can, and always will...as a result of this unique ordinariness, we sell our bulls about half price of the elite breeders; a few guys that have experienced the elite cattle before finding us are so happy they send more than we charge; that`s a win; win...their conscience; our ego...thanks cheers

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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Fri Jan 29, 2016 9:33 am

MKeeney wrote:
near 3 weeks on facebook now and I`m just in awe...every breeder is making great cows; and the best we can do is just make ordinary cows like below, more often...the other breeders don`t even select for their great cows; they are just the by-product of breeding for greater growth numbers; I readily admit that I have to make breeding for this kind my priority to get them as often as we do...we even have to use our own bulls produced in our environment; while these magic breeders in Iowa can AI to everyone else`s bull;feed the male progeny corn in the feedlot to find the biggest yearlings, and that results in sisters that are great on fescue pasture...another breeder can graze irrigated Alfalfa in Montana and use a DNA test to find fescue adapted cattle...isn`t science wonderful??...for promotional sake if nothing else !
One positive in our favor; you can probably run close to three of our cows on the feed that they run two...and if you want more calf, just breed them to Charolais bulls, repeat our profile picture, and sell 30%  more calf than the elites for more per pound...
Of course, that`s commercial dollars, and no respected registered breeder can live on that...we always have, always can, and always will...as a result of this unique ordinariness, we sell our bulls about half price of the elite breeders; a few guys that have experienced the elite cattle before finding us are so happy they send more than we charge; that`s a win; win...their conscience; our ego...thanks cheers


facebook is such a contrived, positive set-up...you must "friend" people that aren`t friendly to your breeding paradigm nor I theirs before you can comment ; there is a "like" button for posts, but no "dislike"...oh well, still not as fakey as the registered business...
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Bob H



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Fri Jan 29, 2016 9:54 am

Mike facebook is for the I people of the world who take selfies and post them thinking that some one wants to look at them. It must also be for breeders who do not look out side of the box but just believe every thing that they write or read. Bob H
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:09 am

Bob H wrote:
Mike  facebook is for the I people of the world who take selfies and post them thinking that some one wants to look at them. It must also be for breeders who do not look out side of the box but just believe every thing that they write or read. Bob H
That's very Christian of you to refer to breeders that way Bob, I'm not that gracious...I think many know what they say is not so, won't ever be so because of natural law...but hey, everyone else does it, so it's ok in the registered con...either love it or leave it...I left it thx to Larry's example,and that has been the most rewarding , freeing move i ever made
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Bob H



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:52 am

Mike true line breeding is not for people that take selfies and it is good not to be living a lie. Bob H
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed Feb 10, 2016 9:02 am

Bob H wrote:
Mike true line breeding is not for people that take selfies and it is good not to be living a lie. Bob H

from PatB


The immediate payoff for genomic testing is more accurate epd's for young animals. What is the value of getting your animals information into the database for future traits and training of the prediction equations? Those that use non main stream genetics should be testing their herd sires to get them into the database for future inclusion into the genomic process.

Pat stumbled into the right question; unfortunately, you can`t stumble into the correct answer...mk
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EddieM



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed Feb 10, 2016 9:14 am

Quote :
Those that use non main stream genetics should be testing their herd sires to get them into the database for future inclusion into the genomic process.
Pat, Reality = they do not care about your cattle or your cattle genes. Your role is to buy THEIR cattle and o-o-o-h and ah-h-h over their success. You will never buy the $250,000 heifer so you are to remain invisible and send money. The new motto of the AAA BOD, "When we want your opinion we'll give it to you." Same thing for politics, government agencies, civic groups, ...
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pukerimu



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed Feb 10, 2016 1:56 pm

Oh Sad - I love facebook - as a kid who moved schools (towns - bank manager father) three times and have about 50 different jobs in 3 organisations (and moved 5 times as an adult - banking and then two farms ...........so far .........) I find facebook to be a fabulous way to reconnect with people whom meant a lot to me many years ago but with whom the correspondence (snail mail) died out almost as many years ago. Give it a try - you might find you like it .................. Very Happy
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EddieM



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:08 pm

pukerimu wrote:
Oh  Sad  - I love facebook - as a kid who moved schools (towns - bank manager father) three times and have about 50 different jobs in 3 organisations (and moved 5 times as an adult - banking and then two farms ...........so far .........) I find facebook to be a fabulous way to reconnect with people whom meant a lot to me many years ago but with whom the correspondence (snail mail) died out almost as many years ago.   Give it a try - you might find you like it .................. Very Happy

You are assuming that I have or have had friends or knew folks who would want to hear from me! jocolor
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed Feb 10, 2016 6:19 pm

EddieM wrote:
Quote :
Those that use non main stream genetics should be testing their herd sires to get them into the database for future inclusion into the genomic process.
Pat, Reality = they do not care about your cattle or your cattle genes.  Your role is to buy THEIR cattle and o-o-o-h and ah-h-h over their success.  You will never buy the $250,000 heifer so you are to remain invisible and send money.  The new motto of the AAA BOD, "When we want your opinion we'll give it to you."  Same thing for politics, government agencies, civic groups, ...

there`s a like button I would click on facebook for the above...maybe do it twice...

so what if we had 10`s of thousand of perfectly accurate epds, how much more profitable would/could you be...??? most still would be clueless,,,well, on further thought, I would be clueless as well, as to what constitutes the proper level for maximum profitability...much ado about nothing more than the con game...
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EddieM



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed Feb 10, 2016 9:25 pm

The herd prefix tells most want-to-be registered breeders to buy now and worry about the faults later rather than study the EPDs. The presence of EPDs merely provide scientific data for proof of progressive thinking. Gene testing adds a gold star for the day to the proof.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Fri Feb 12, 2016 7:24 pm

MKeeney wrote:
EddieM wrote:
Quote :
Those that use non main stream genetics should be testing their herd sires to get them into the database for future inclusion into the genomic process.
Pat, Reality = they do not care about your cattle or your cattle genes.  Your role is to buy THEIR cattle and o-o-o-h and ah-h-h over their success.  You will never buy the $250,000 heifer so you are to remain invisible and send money.  The new motto of the AAA BOD, "When we want your opinion we'll give it to you."  Same thing for politics, government agencies, civic groups, ...

there`s a like button I would click on  facebook for the above...maybe do it twice...

so what if we had 10`s of thousand of perfectly accurate epds, how much more profitable would/could you be...??? most still would be clueless,,,well, on further thought, I would be clueless as well, as to what constitutes the proper  level for maximum profitability...much ado about nothing more than the con game...

After browsing the facebook bs for three weeks now, I can report that the con game still relies more on fat, hair, and straw to enhance their bulls than genomics...
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EddieM



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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Fri Feb 12, 2016 8:36 pm

MKeeney wrote:
MKeeney wrote:
EddieM wrote:
Quote :
Those that use non main stream genetics should be testing their herd sires to get them into the database for future inclusion into the genomic process.
Pat, Reality = they do not care about your cattle or your cattle genes.  Your role is to buy THEIR cattle and o-o-o-h and ah-h-h over their success.  You will never buy the $250,000 heifer so you are to remain invisible and send money.  The new motto of the AAA BOD, "When we want your opinion we'll give it to you."  Same thing for politics, government agencies, civic groups, ...

there`s a like button I would click on  facebook for the above...maybe do it twice...

so what if we had 10`s of thousand of perfectly accurate epds, how much more profitable would/could you be...??? most still would be clueless,,,well, on further thought, I would be clueless as well, as to what constitutes the proper  level for maximum profitability...much ado about nothing more than the con game...

After browsing the facebook bs for three weeks now, I can report that the con game still relies more on fat, hair, and straw to enhance their bulls than genomics...
A great bull is like a lady with class: she does not show her ankles in public.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Sun Feb 21, 2016 8:43 am

MKeeney wrote:
MKeeney wrote:
EddieM wrote:
Quote :
Those that use non main stream genetics should be testing their herd sires to get them into the database for future inclusion into the genomic process.
Pat, Reality = they do not care about your cattle or your cattle genes.  Your role is to buy THEIR cattle and o-o-o-h and ah-h-h over their success.  You will never buy the $250,000 heifer so you are to remain invisible and send money.  The new motto of the AAA BOD, "When we want your opinion we'll give it to you."  Same thing for politics, government agencies, civic groups, ...

there`s a like button I would click on  facebook for the above...maybe do it twice...

so what if we had 10`s of thousand of perfectly accurate epds, how much more profitable would/could you be...??? most still would be clueless,,,well, on further thought, I would be clueless as well, as to what constitutes the proper  level for maximum profitability...much ado about nothing more than the con game...

After browsing the facebook bs for three weeks now, I can report that the con game still relies more on fat, hair, and straw to enhance their bulls than genomics...


The random cow beside the road is always good enough when the objective of optimum stabilization has been achieved. She sheds her
hair instead of needing a herdsman to clip it; she has a switch as normal cows do; instead of being genomically tested for fescue; she lives,
thrives, and reproduces on it. She has no credentials for the registered game; but everything she needs to be a good commercial cow.
We, and she, reproduce her kind consistently.
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MKeeney
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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Tue Feb 23, 2016 8:01 am

want 1535 lb of prime plus? use Wagyu and get calving ease as well...



want a better cow? see us Smile

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PostSubject: Re: 2016 Keeney Angus Bull Sale   Wed Feb 24, 2016 7:54 am


posted at Facebook; redundant reading here...
Today`s picture cow was not random; selection factors were the sun at my back; and her leg back so we could see her udder...I don`t like her high tail head; but we can always tolerate some flawed pieces; if the overall pattern is our preferred type.. Lingle surmised, "over time, goodness has a pattern"...and her  pattern is commonplace in the herd...
 I happen to be able to name her sire; but what`s a name on a piece of paper mean if you {not me} have no familiarity with the characteristics common to the individual or his progeny? EPD`s you say? then tell me the proper epds of a good cow, please ? I am getting rather forgetful after turning 70  Smile , so I just remember what it is we want a cow to do. As registered fads change, we stay the same; preferring to persist commercially than risk perishing pursuing the latest popular correctional type change. Dispersal is not in our 54 year resume; and great  or our best bull ever has never been in our vocabulary. To have been so in the registered business, would have required us to have had the shortest, tallest, milkiest, thickest, fattest, squarest, highest numbers, rarest number combination, at different times in our history. Today`s technology offers great potential for good; and as Wendell Berry notes, equal potential for bad...but science has yet to replace common cow sense, and as Abe Lincoln noted, "common sense ain`t so common".
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